Vote for kick system

[StolleJay]

In my opinion we should have a "vote for kick" system where someone can start a vote for kicking a troll user. Everyone on the server can then vote. And if as ex. 60% are for kicking the troll then he should be kicked for the next 24h.
If this user then has in a specific time multiple reports for trolling or other not humanity things then he should get banned for lifetime or at least for minimum 1 month from the multiplayer mode.

I dont see currently any other chance to get rid of those senseless trolls. Its not fun at the moment!

Today from our Discord server:
A user reported a dispatcher that was trolling and only sent trains with backup signals, and each train could only travel at 20 km/h. After a few chat messages about, among other things, that he should please announce the trains, he replied that he was too lazy to do so, that he did what he wanted, and that he didn't care about anything. Later, he blocked everything so that no one could send him more trains.

[Pufferknutscher]

I would have it a bit less harsh, so the votekick only kicks them, not "bans" them for a day. I would just let the votekick do a kick with a message of "please do not troll." If they continue trolling on another server and another votekick has been initiated, I would start with the longer timeouts.

[Záhorácká]

Potentially dangerous. Might get kicked even inocent.. but yeah we need some kind of protection system

[Fightdrug]

and what do you do when a troller and his gang abuse this system to kick and ban player that did nothing wrong ? i see that often in other games stuff like this can ruin your game more as a trolling dispatcher at all trust me

what we need is a AI system that figure out  someone troll like when train 24xxx dont leave the station after 10 min of reaching the entrance signal the first time when that happens the AI take care of that train and set a route for it and warn the dispatcher when that happens the second time with a other train the dispatcher get a ban for 1 day 🙂

Edited January 17, 2023 by Fightdrug

[Skully]

At the end of the day you end up with a voting system that never works as desired. Either it'll get gang-banged or half the server doesn't care.

[Fightdrug]

vor 3 Minuten schrieb Skully:

At the end of the day you end up with a voting system that never works as desired. Either it'll get gang-banged or half the server doesn't care.

like it was in chivalry medieval warfare or rightnow it is in chivalry 2 the half server dont vote or vote no even when they see right now that the TD is over 400 or you have that dudes that even write in the chat ,,go get him boys" and you get kicked for nothing

[Howky]

How about taking inspiration from the IVAO? and create a similar structure

Link: https://www.ivao.aero/

 

 

[weezzah]

I'd say have different levels like:

• First a timeout for 30 min (user has to chill)
• Second time a timeout for 1 hour (dude, seriously)
• Third time it's a kick, 24 hrs (verified troll)
• If 10 kicks then banned for a year (troll is obviously incapable of changing)

And maybe have user stats showing counts for timeout, kicks, and bans. That way people on the server would know who they're dealing with.

Later on, SimRail staff could process ban appeals live on Twitch, jk, but would be fun though 😉

But seriously, I'd prefer to be without such a system, and I'd think a train sim is more likely to not need one. If anything I think maybe the dispatcher role should be harder to get, and maybe given mod privileges, only if, they've proven their reliability from stats like hours or successful dispatching. After all they're the all-seeing eye on the servers, sort of.

 

[Howky]

3 hours ago, weezzah said:

I'd say have different levels like:

• First a timeout for 30 min (user has to chill)
• Second time a timeout for 1 hour (dude, seriously)
• Third time it's a kick, 24 hrs (verified troll)
• If 10 kicks then banned for a year (troll is obviously incapable of changing)

And maybe have user stats showing counts for timeout, kicks, and bans. That way people on the server would know who they're dealing with.

Later on, SimRail staff could process ban appeals live on Twitch, jk, but would be fun though 😉

But seriously, I'd prefer to be without such a system, and I'd think a train sim is more likely to not need one. If anything I think maybe the dispatcher role should be harder to get, and maybe given mod privileges, only if, they've proven their reliability from stats like hours or successful dispatching. After all they're the all-seeing eye on the servers, sort of.

and who will make sure that 5 trolls don't meet and report a player who is playing fine

 

Wouldn't it be better to set up private servers. And lock them with a password. 
And leave the admins in charge.
Giving them the ability to kick players off the server if necessary ?

[weezzah]

I don't think five trolls voting to kick random users is not going to happen that often, but it could happen once in a while for sure. No system available to the public is perfect because of the human factor.

I think the public servers should be monitored closely by SimRail staff during early access, and from there see what the trend is, and how to deal with it.

Agreed, private servers + (optional) password is your best bet, and a very common way of doing multiplayer. SimRail has only public servers planned for right?

[SurvivorSean]

Global moderators was suggested.  Probably the best method.

[Fightdrug]

Am 17.1.2023 um 18:26 schrieb Howky:

and who will make sure that 5 trolls don't meet and report a player who is playing fine

Wouldn't it be better to set up private servers. And lock them with a password. 
And leave the admins in charge.
Giving them the ability to kick players off the server if necessary ?

and whats later =? right now the game is new so they can focus on be at the servers but what is later when they done with simrail and get over to simbus ? do you think they have the time then to take care live about trollers and programming a new game ?

with the AI system that handle trollers they can focusing other things as watch for kids 🙂

Edited January 19, 2023 by Fightdrug

[FluffyAdmiral]

There is a report system in the game. Just use it and over time trolls will be gone.

1. Press TAB to open the list of players.

2. Left click on a player and a small menu will pop up.

3. Click on the button that shows exclamation mark icon "!"

4. In the window that shows up, select the reason of your report and write a short description of the problem or provide addtional context for the reason of your report.

5. Press "Report" button to submit.

Edited January 19, 2023 by FluffyAdmiral

[Fightdrug]

vor 11 Minuten schrieb FluffyAdmiral:

There is a report system in the game. Just use it and over time trolls will be gone.

1. Press TAB to open the list of players.

2. Left click on a player and a small menu will pop up.

3. Click on the button that shows exclamation mark icon "!"

4. In the window that shows up, select the reason of your report and write a short description of the problem or provide addtional context for the reason of your report.

5. Press "Report" button to submit.

i done this one time as a player trolling via blocking the exit switches and nothing happens he just leave later because he see i send the trains just over the left track ^^

[Thistle Whistle]

As said, this is simply a report.  It's not an instant action, rather someone who builds up a lot of negative reports may receive some kind of punishment.  I have no idea whether it is being utilised. 

There is no perfect solution to this problem.

[Howky]

2 hours ago, Thistle Whistle said:

As said, this is simply a report.  It's not an instant action, rather someone who builds up a lot of negative reports may receive some kind of punishment.  I have no idea whether it is being utilised. 

There is no perfect solution to this problem.

Exist = Private Servers
Where the admins will be.
 

[Thistle Whistle]

5 minutes ago, Howky said:

Exist = Private Servers
Where the admins will be.
 

Well not really.  Private servers don't fix the problem on public servers.

[pschlik]

One problem I have with a vote kick system in SimRail specifically is how big the map is. If I'm at Sedziszow and I see a vote kick pop up, how am I supposed to know if the person voting to be kicked is actually disruptive? If I haven't seen them recently, I won't even know where they are. It's entirely possible they are blocking the line out at Warsaw...but I'm so far from there it doesn't affect me. Or maybe they were using slurs in chat at Lazy, but I'm out of radio range so I've never interacted with them. Maybe they are innocent, explaining so in voice chat, and someone else is out to get them...but I never even encountered them this session, so I just assume the reporter is acting in good faith and vote to kick anyway. Because of all that, good luck getting an accurate consensus in a server of 50 people.

It's not like Team Fortress 2, where chat is visible to everyone, and the world is small enough that you are likely to personally encounter a cheater or other troublemaker. That makes it a lot easier to see a vote kick and think "Oh yeah, I've seen that guy being a jerk."

[FluffyAdmiral]

That's why you can only report the situation and the game will, hopefully, save logs from the server at the time when the report is sent so that developers can investigate and take actions if needed. Votekick is not going to solve the problem and in fact, it may make it worse as trolls can use it against the players that just want to play the game.

[SurvivorSean]

Logs are very important.  Not sure why I got down voted for global moderators as I think it's better than a vote system.  I understand the idea behind it, but believe it would be more a PITA and can be used against legitimate people by the trolls as mentioned.

If you have logs and trusted moderators (either employees or those in the community that have a good history) then you will see a reduction of this isssue.  Of course having private servers solves lots of these issues. 

I know some people complain about private servers taking away from the public server pool.  Trust me I know the feeling but in the reverse.  I ran a private server in Run8 years ago and can tell you the more private servers that come on line the chance less people visit you for whatever reason.  It was through a time when there was no AI in Run8 which made it very tough.  By V2 they had AI but you needed people to dispatch and run.  By V3 they now have AI dispatchers, but still need people to run the switching and yards. 

Each version they get better so the fact that we have full AI right now and currently no switching means running on a private server you are interested in will allow you to run with like minded people with a set of rules that meet your own personal criteria.  It will also mean MORE opportunity to get the chance to run bigger signal boxes (something that the current demand for big boxes is starting to show as people race to get the few limited challenging positions).  As the number of people grow it will only get more crowded on servers.  Hell look at the numbers on the Polish servers (obviously the most popular being a Polish simulator.  I bet you they would love to see some private servers.  Private servers is the ultimate way to solve the issues, and the public you are left to your own devices to deal with it.

Thanks

Sean

[Howky]

16 hours ago, Thistle Whistle said:

Well not really.  Private servers don't fix the problem on public servers.

Probably the best way to answer that would be a poll. But I think people will prefer private servers over public ones. And then we wouldn't have to deal with trolls.

[Skully]

It is already well established that people would like to see private servers to run by their own rules. This would even allow for shunting and coupling within the current engine (as we saw it in the early stages of playtesting). Although the AI is not ready for that (yet).

What is also established is the fact that SimRail hasn't been designed with privately hosted servers in mind. Just read through:

Furthermore the public servers should be able to run with as little moderation as possible to keep operational cost down.

I think once dispatcher XP and levelling comes into play we can propose a strike system. Something already on the radar.

Once all of that is dealt with maybe private hosting can become a realistic goal again.

Alternatively maybe public expert servers could be put into operation which do allow for more maneuvers.

[Footz]

Voting to kick is not the way to go, how am I supposed to know that just departing from Warsaw that sb in Sosnowiec is causing mayham on the tracks and needs kicking? Even if I trusted the guy who reports it, he doesn't have the means to contact me so far away.

[Kaito Kid]

8 minutes ago, Footz said:

Voting to kick is not the way to go, how am I supposed to know that just departing from Warsaw that sb in Sosnowiec is causing mayham on the tracks and needs kicking? Even if I trusted the guy who reports it, he doesn't have the means to contact me so far away.

Hmmm... Maybe vote kick between neighboring stations only? Or just maybe between dispatchers.

[FluffyAdmiral]

6 minutes ago, Kaito Kid said:

Hmmm... Maybe vote kick between neighboring stations only? Or just maybe between dispatchers.

Votekick would just promote hostilities and toxic behaviours rather than solve any problems in a long run. 

Report system was put in place to let the admins look into the problem using all the evidence and then decide if the player needs to be penalised in any way. This needs time to work though and it may not allow to solve the problems instantly as many players would like to see it. Perhaps having some global moderators to look into the reports at all times would work, but this would require the game to have high enough popularity to pay for itself.