Bug? or just lack of understanding of the rules for routing?

[Urgentemente]

Not sure if this is a bug, or lack of understanding on my part of the rules for train routing, but I had an 'odd' situation early hours of Tuesday morning (empty EN1 server so wasn't likely to affect anyone else thankfully even if I had messed up..)
 

I was dispatching at Psary, AI at Knapowka requested "is path for train 1303 on track 2 clear?"
I replied that it was, AI confirmed/repeated, then it cancelled train 1303 ! (see screenshots...)

 

No big deal I thought, next train from Knapowka was 24105, I set the route through on main line as 1303 had been cancelled..

but then 1303 appears behind 24105, so quick thinking, (well, quick for me in the early hours of the morning..), I cancelled the last part of the main route through for 24105, so it would stop, then routed 1303 via the side line, so it could get past...

but it would not let me 'finish' the route to open up from O to T  to allow 1303 through and past the slower 24105...

Kept giving me "The set route from signal Ps_0 would send train 1303 in the wrong direction. Route will be released..."

 

I have no idea *why* tho, anyone see if I was doing something wrong?

 

 

Edited January 11, 2023 by Urgentemente
fixed server name to EN1

[Jesitim]

1303 is a train that needs to go to the other line, it branches off. So what you needed to do was put a route in from signal O to signal W (see screenshot)

For Psary always look at the timetable for Line No 570, these are the trains coming and going from the Starzyny line.
Hope this helps in the future 🙂

[Urgentemente]

Oh, how stupid of me, !  sorry!!!!  Thanks for the correction  🙂

I've dispatched at Psary a couple of more times since then and had a few trains down that way, guess I wasn't exactly wide awake !

What about the AI cancelling the train, after confirming it had received my "line is clear" , then despatching without announcing it (which is why I *mistakenly* tried to route it past the slower train in the first place!  )

 

 

[Fightdrug]

the AI at knapowka ask you that because he try to send that train he ask you over the other track ( because the regular track is allready in use from 24105 ) and he cancel the train because he see later he can send it behind 24105 over the regular track normaly you can ignore that request from knapowka the trains will just come behind eachother 🙂

[Skully]

This "Train ... cancelled" message leaves a lot to be desired. A better message would be "Disregard previous messages of train ...".

Still the message could be more informative by stating what the AI is actually intending to do with the train.

[robert357 - W7 FTW]

The thing is, as a dispatcher you have communicate with other dispatchers using certain phrases listed in R-1 instruction. "Train X cancelled" is one of them.

[Skully]

2 hours ago, robert357 said:

The thing is, as a dispatcher you have communicate with other dispatchers using certain phrases listed in R-1 instruction. "Train X cancelled" is one of them.

Good point however I can find no such instruction in R-1.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1g-uorn6BElwUeoPNBQ-GZ-z9GR6mE9Y2l46X8VIvZZA/edit#gid=0

[robert357 - W7 FTW]

Right now I'm not 100% sure, so I hope if someone who knows better can correct me. So, in R-1 instruction words "stopped" and "cancelled" have different meanings. Stopped trains means, well, that train has been stopped for various reasons (mostly due to safety concerns) and can't continue at this moment. Train also can be stopped at any moment, in station, on main line etc. IRL you can't just stop the train with no reason. Cancelled trains basically means that train didn't or cannot departure even if everything is in order. In instruction there is mentioned you inform crossing keeper and/or "dispatcher assistant" (I don't know how they are called in English) that train is cancelled, not stopped. Game is little different, because it's just a game. You can't talk with AI and ask if train X is late or whatever, or ask someone "higher above you" that know what is going on. That why this massage has been added. Example with Łazy Łc and Dąbrowa Górnicza Ząbkowice in game. AI will send to Łazy train A on track 4. Then it will ask if it's clear to send train B on track 3 but because it's probably programmed to not send trains on opposite track it will do nothing until first block on track 4 will be clear. Because now it's possible for AI to send train B on track 4 it will send "train X cancelled" so player will know to not wait for direction change for track 3 and can send trains on that track. Or I'm wrong and this should be "Train X stopped" ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Lawliet]

A decent alternate would be "Disregard previous information or request for Train #####." instead of saying 'cancelled', which to us English speakers make it seem like yeah, the train's cancelled and will not proceed ahead.

[Skully]

I'm not an expert either and my Polish isn't any better than Google translate. 😁

§ 24 ust. 15 might make sense.

Quote

Telefonogram zawiadamiający o zatrzymaniu pociągu(ów) nadaje się również wtedy, gdy zatrzymanie pociągu nastąpiło bez otrzymania żądania zatrzymania pociągu(ów), na który(e) otrzymano pozwolenie na wyprawienie. Nadanie zawiadomienia o zatrzymaniu pociągu(ów) telefonogramem wzór 8a lub nr 8b unieważnia otrzymane pozwolenie na wyprawienie tego pociągu (pociągów), wskutek czego wyprawienie jakiegokolwiek pociągu na ten tor szlakowy wymaga nadania żądania i otrzymania nowego pozwolenia na wyprawienie.

Quote

The telegram notifying the stop of the train(s) shall also be transmitted when the stop of the train has been made without receiving a request to stop the train(s) for which permission to dispatch has been received. Sending a notice of stopping a train(s) by telegram template 8a or 8b invalidates the received permission to dispatch this train(s), as a result of which sending any train to this route track requires sending a request and obtaining a new permission to dispatch.

At least that is how the game behaves. Which would mean 8a: "Train # is stopped" is the preferable template.

Edited January 12, 2023 by Skully

[Skully]

I betting there are more rule nerds on the Polish forum: 😄