Cyclone

All right, it seems a path set for another train near the end of the session was successful. I think the problem therefore occurs if you lock points, which should ensure they cannot be changed, but should NOT make it impossible to path the train. The idea was to put pink on the Mystowice points.

I had been getting kicked from Bedzin since Day 1 with no explanation of why. Now I know why. And it just happened after I read someone else say something about it, so I have come to confirm it as a bug. Notice the player list above, on EN1. Less than five minutes before, Dabrowa Gornicza was not there. The Bedzin player was the same. I literally reported the following from the Discord chat maybe 30 seconds before the Bedzin player was interrupted mid-sentence and terminated: "game kicks out a player from the server in Bedzin when somebody joins either Sosnowiec or Dabrowa Gornicza (tested with friend few times)" (posted by BaddeK) After reading that, Bedzin comments, "I have a train heading your way", and nothing else is said. After a casual, "Copy that", I hit TAB to notice the Bedzin player missing. I again orated this possibly sounding in disbelief, and say it just happened, and Bedzin rejoined by then to say yup, he got kicked after the screen went black, etc. This is therefore a rerproducable bug by anyone who hops in to Bedzin on any server. As soon as someone else joins either Sosnowiec Glowny or Dabrowa Gornizcza, the Bedzin player will be removed.

As a follow-up, the path later worked with no train present. I'm not sure if it's just being selective, but I will try with a train in the platform again.

It is not currently possible to create the indicated path. I utilized a substitute signal to clear the path. This is my only recourse to be able to use the platform. The path link used to work and needs to be repaired.

EN6 is now clogged up. It seems to be for a different reason, as traffic into SG from SP was plugged and a couple trains eventually crashed to clear it out, but now SD is not sending traffic west.

Can someone explain how train 42122 (indicated) got here, how it's blocking train 42127 (at the station, east), and why all other traffic that exits Line 4 (currently eight other trains) cannot proceed? Knapowka, FR2.

Also, a live shot of EN8. It seems the single track is indeed the problem here and requires a hotfix. SP dispatching is also indirectly related, and is the same issue reported coming from the east going west as well. Separating the tracks so each is one directional for AI use is the best policy, I believe. This way, SG sees a train not cleared and tells KZ not to send trains for that line, but a KZ AI will just automatically send on Track 2 without thinking and block that up too! I suggest a KZ AI dispatcher should ask SG if Line 660 is clear. If so, it sends a 42xxx train. If not, it holds it and sends something else instead. This would work with my suggestions in another thread.

Thank you! Adding what happened just now on DE4 to the mix, it's the same issue but somehow this train is way up close to the station.

An hour later, it looks like this:

Zamu on the Discord server has been documenting train movements since the start of the playtest. He has generated the attached image for what happened in DE1 during this session. This comes before I started reporting. I see two trains got moved into SG very close to each other. As a result, SP sent them to both tracks like with the problem coming the other way. This caused SD to not send traffic. It's very clear the problem is that SP AI needs full access to how the line from SD is handled at all times, and once the line is clear needs to flip the line again immediately - even without a train - to ensure that he can control the movement of trains from Line 1 Track 2. I don't think even my proposal to only use one platform each way at SP will mean anything in this very extreme situation - and I stress, this is an extreme situation, but it clearly can happen that two trains are sent close, Line 660 remains blocked, and SG has his hands tied.

42134 has taken out 24927 and both are in train heav-...I mean the scrapyard. Meanwhile, 42136 has departed Katowice bound for Kielce. It won't get far. 42184 is also ahead of it en route to SG, bound for Skarżysko-Kamienna. A few minutes later, freight stops too. At the same time, SG - blissfully unaware of ANY of this because it's a different radio channel- sends 42184 down into the mess: I'd tell him to hike down the track and take a look, but his Tracks 1 and 2 are currently flowing perfectly fine. He has to stay at his post. Another few minutes later, we have a worldwide first. 42136 is admitted to Line 660, and SG only now is about to learn of the problems going on at Dandowka. We have achieved total gridlock with three trains at SP all going east. And the SG dispatcher is NOT at fault. Freight traffic still seems to be taking the 171, but passenger traffic can't do a damn thing now. I'm going to further my suggestion post from yesterday and say we need access to both Sosnowiec Poludniowy and Sosnowiec Dandowka immediately.

As an update, one of the trains at SP got some movement. However, it seems to have hit a wall again. Cheers to Jesitim, a playtest player, for trying. Also, 24929 has joined the mosh pit on Track 1 at SD: The only clear route for 42134 (Jesitim) right now is Track 2. And I don't know if it's signalled in that direction or not. I would assume so because right lane running, and it CAN get back to 62, but maybe it's designated as a wrong direction...

So DE1 got jammed today at Sosnowiec Poludniowy. No, not because of actions at SG. That's something else. Let me explain what you see here. On the left: 42134 bound for Kielce on track 1, 42182 bound for Skarżysko-Kamienna (Line 8 and Line 25 intersection) on Track 2. Beyond is the Single Track of Hell. On the other side of the Single Track of Hell, trains are piling up. Let me briefly explain the track layout at Dandowka. Track 5 is Line 62. Track 3 is, I'm told, a disused line between the stations. Line 1 is north of Platform 2. Line 2 is south of Platform 2 (an island platform). Line 4 is next, and they continue in even numbers. So Line 5 is occupied by 24927 bound for Katowice Ligota. 24131 is bound for Gliwice, and was dumped onto track 6. Down on track 8 is 24179, bound for Gliwice These last two both came from Kielce. Nobody is moving. You cannot blame this on players. This is entirely the AI being as intelligent as the developers. You cannot blame the SG dispatcher for both lines being blocked at Sosnowiec Poludniowy. He can't dispatch those. So hey - maybe some of us know what the hell we're talking about. Maybe we can help solve bugs with stations under development if you ask us nicely.

I dare to suggest they are celebrating Halloween.

Believe it or not, I posted an analysis dictating this, oh, 11 hours ago, but it's locked in "Pending approval" status. Keep an eye on the suggestions forum.

No, you could do this before. It's the only one I've seen that does this. You can also use a substitute signal, however, but make sure you properly set the path first or you're going to have a problem.

There is also no ticket verification system for passengers. Let's worry about the core of the game first.

Thank you for quickly clearing this up for the user. Can you please look at my post from earlier today which addresses the Sosnowiec Poludniowy issues in further detail and proposes a fix? I think implementing a procedure like what I outline there will prevent these blocks from happening - that is, unless a player forces them to happen, and by that point I would blame the player.

This ban needs to be reversed immediately. I have a yet to be approved thread (new user here, see) that will address this in detail. It's related to Sosnowiec.

Evidence of why the current AI doesn't work. Two trains on the right both got routed in, westbound. With my steps, the second train would stay at the single line entrance and the other platform would be clear, letting the train on 660 enter.

If we ever get the chance to start and end at a station, we'll likely get a small extension to Warsaw or a route to Katowice Ligata, which is en route to Tychy, which loops around to Mystowice. So we have a couple of spots where services can start and end in the future, once they figure out the mechanics. It would actually be nice to have each individual train represented like in a real schedule, so Train 609 is responsible for this service followed by this service, and if the first is running late the second also starts late. Oh, and also the link of Lines 8 and 25 being a destination for a Line 62 service.

This is simply explained by the title alone. It can happen in phone communication boxes (the chat ones where you type one word, space, and the rest of the sentence goes in the main chat box. You can copy and paste it, but come on now. Better to clog up the radio at this point. You can also leave your train or building and jump around on a platfo-...oh, wait, now you have to type that all-important chat message and stop jumping around, you loafer. When adding a sign above something in the computer, you type the text you want to apply to th-...wait, now I am not typing. OK, let's try again...and now it's set. Oh, where did those letters in the chat box come from? You guessed it. Note I have not run the recent update yet, and will report if this is fixed. Just wondering how many others have this problem. BTW, there is one way it doesn't happen. Hide the entire UI. You can run and jump to your heart's content.

We can already hop in and control the train from a cab ride functionality. That's IMO all we should need if we let the AI drive our train. That said, I wish you could spawn in and wander around to some extent, I will give that. That said, it can bog down a multiplayer server.

Before I begin, I want to note that there have been bans since I submitted this post for approval against players for "blocking the line". What I'm about to go into is a literally foolproof method of AI operation that ensures the AI literally cannot block the line even if a player tries to send a train. This involves only using one platform and leaving the other for southbound traffic, and if there's a train at that platform, do not accept any additional southbound traffic. It's that simple to keep this area from plugging it up. Until this is implemented, this block will continue to occur, and the player is not to blame. There should be no bans for bad programming. It's that simple. Let me be absolutely frank. The way the AI in the system operates, an attempt will always be made to get trains onto any platform that is available. Even if it's not logical or could block up traffic. It has happened at Katowice with westbound traffic at all eight platforms and nowhere for eastbound traffic to go. And it also happens at Sosnowiec on Line 660. NOTE: In the following, "Platform 1" refers to a stop on the island platform at Track 1, and "Platform 2" refers to a stop at the island platform on Track 2; in the UK, this is exactly how the platform and tracks are designated. Right now, the AI at the station puts a train correctly through the right side (platform 1) of the island platform when the station is empty. This is correct behaviour. It should then ask for clearance for the train before accepting any other trains off of the single track. Let's assume SG does not respond. The next train coming in will be put into the left platform (platform 2), and we have no tracks for traffic from SG at this point. I'm not going to explore this situation specifically, but one slightly different. Sometimes, a train will be received to Platform 1 but the AI will not offer it to SG. For instance, 42915 (I'm making up the numbers) arrives, but 24157 is hot behind in the single lane. SP will not offer 42915, but instead wait for 24157 to arrive at Platform 2 and then offer that to SG instead. If the player tries to send a train at the wrong moment, with no trains offered in time, this creates gridlock and closes Line 660. The only fix is to sub signal a human driver back into the section leading to Katowice Zawodzie and then ask SP to take over the red arrow with its traffic, and thus block up Line 2 - which has express trains, way higher priority than anything SP has - blocked up while the problem is being solved. NOTE: There is roughly a one or two minute window where the second train is coming and the AI says more important traffic is coming, but a player can still send a train to Platform 2. If timed correctly, the train in Platform 1 is forced to be offered to SG instead - which it should be anyway. The AI needs to be changed as such: 1. A train enter Platform 1 (correct) and is IMMEDIATELY offered to SG 2. Platform 2 is not used at all by the SP AI (a human still can in the future with proper communication so as to not block up the line) 3. A second train is stopped at the single line entrance to the station and held there until the train on Platform 1 is received 4. Should a player try sending a train, Platform 2 stays open and one train can thus be cleared safely 5. Should a player try to send a second train while Platform 2 is occupied, the AI should specifically be checking the area around Platform 2 (NOT the single line) 6. Reactions should apply to both phone and computer attempts to send the second train: 6a. If a phone call is made, say the line is blocked by an occupied train (Platform 2), don't say anything about the incoming train; continue to do this until the player clues in that a train needs to be accepted to prevent gridlock 6b. If a computer attempt is made to bypass the phone and change the arrow, the AI already knows Platform 2 is occupied and ignores the request to set the junction like any reasonable human dispatcher would 7. Once the Platform 1 train is accepted, any holding train is moved to Platform 1; if the line to Dandowka is clear, the Platform 2 train proceeds, but if not, the next train also needs to be accepted by SG in an attempt to clear the single line or Platform 2 will remain unavailable This keeps the critical Line 660 clear and prevents total gridlock from occurring. The only problem at this point is that a path can be cancelled and the dispatch arrow is not recoverable. This is why we need a human; substitute signals bypass this problem. We also need a special operation to reset an arrow to a grey status. Other than that, 90% of SG problems are solved by the above AI logic steps. As a final note, a SG dispatcher can use a substitute signal to force one or more trains (it can happen!) onto 660. This is, done improperly, a possible attempt to thwart the game and can be seen as a player intentionally plugging the line. A developer once commented on Discord that it's currently our own fault for plugging up the line even though the AI does not behave correctly. This creates negative PR for your company and your game. Be careful what you say to players! I urge this kind of behaviour on all single line branch lines now and in the future and am available to provide information on the developer end if requested.

This can be abused. Say the threshold is three people. Three buddies on the radio can vote to kick out a player at a station until their buddy gets into the station. I am not in favour of this system.